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Post by wstevens on Mar 20, 2010 10:40:08 GMT
I just want to gauge people's responses to this.
The question is if a magical banner confers a special attack be it the banner of murder, the Spider banner (poison attacks), or a banner that gives your guys flamming attacks: do the attacks count as magical as well? I have asked this question over at several other forums and have got the same answer time and again. I will put a poll up for people to vote on what they think should happen. I will not vote initially so that people cannot see what I think. I will let people know the answer that I got from other forums in due course.
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Post by carl on Mar 20, 2010 10:57:34 GMT
surely if its a magical banner and gives a specific attack these attacks are only confered due to the 'magical' banner be present. therefore if this banner were eliminated, if it were on a BSB for example then if he dies the unit would lose the magical element of the attack, and revert to their normal non magical attack.
so i think they would be classed as magical attacks as long as the banner is present.
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Post by wstevens on Mar 20, 2010 11:18:21 GMT
Interesting.......
but what about if it was on a normal standard bearer which is the last to do in a unit?
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Post by carl on Mar 20, 2010 14:11:40 GMT
then it stays right to the end i suppose
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Post by Stephen Mawson on Mar 20, 2010 15:24:44 GMT
I'm not sure what you're asking here.
Do you mean is the special attack from the banner magical? Or do you mean does the banner make the units attacks magical?
My opinion on magical banners is that any attacks from the banner itself would have to count as magical. But that unless the banner states otherwise the unit's own attacks aren't magical.
For example the Skaven Banner of the Under Empire inflicts 2D6 Strength 2 Hits on every enemy unit in contact with the unit at the start of each close combat round. Those Strength 2 attacks would clearly be magical. But the Skaven unit's own attacks would not be magical.
However the Vampire Counts Banner of Hellfire specifically conveys Magical Flaming attacks on the unit that carries it, so that banner would cause the units own attacks to be magical.
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Jon Nicholls
Gates of Antares
Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory...
Posts: 403
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Post by Jon Nicholls on Mar 20, 2010 15:35:55 GMT
I think I would agree with Stephen, in that it's specific to the banner.
In the case of Nogg's Banner of Butchery from the O&G book, this banner gives every model in the unit +1 attack for one round of combat. I would say that these are not magical attacks. It is the ability to gain the extra attack which is confered so, as far as I can see, there is no reason why the attacks themselves should be classed as magical.
In Stephen's Skaven example though, as he states, the attacks by the banner itself are obviously magical.
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Jon Nicholls
Gates of Antares
Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory...
Posts: 403
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Post by Jon Nicholls on Mar 20, 2010 15:39:11 GMT
...and I think that also goes for the Spider Banner. The magical ability of the banner is to grant poison attacks, there is no mention of them also being magical.
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Post by Kierons on Mar 20, 2010 19:34:49 GMT
I agree with Stephen as well....
It all depends on the specific banner.
Banner of Murder for D.E. confers the Armour Piercing rule, but that doesnt make the attacks magical.
Kieron
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Post by wstevens on Mar 20, 2010 23:47:46 GMT
Ok I get the jist now - if they specifically say magical attacks then... for example the hellfire banner, then that's that. If they do not specifically say Magic attack then they are not. For example the spider banner conveys poisoned attacks but the word "magical" does not appear. I think my answer has been found.
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